1.9 CDTi won't start no response from ECU

[dreamvictim]

I have a 2006 Zafira 1.9 CDTi, Z19DTH engine. She's been running absolutely fine until yesterday morning when she wouldn't start. I managed to get her to start once or twice but she cut out again.

OPCOM says "no response from engine ecu"

Dash lights come on with ignition but eml goes out, petrol gauge goes down and "F" is displayed in the fuel computer display when it doesn't start.

I've checked the ecu multiplugs and fuses in the engine compartment and all appear to be ok.

Is there anything else I can check before assuming the ECU is faulty?

Cheers, any help is much appreciated as usual! :)

[lurossi]

hello, to file revised wiring connecting carrier with engine compartment happened to me that this breakout failed, greetings

[lurossi]

misspelled my automatic translator, check card carrier, motor

[lurossi]

interconnection bodywork, engine

[dreamvictim]

Hi, thank you for your reply.

Where is the connection located?

[Ashraf6119]

Hi

If you are using Op-Com than my advice is to Diagnose all the Modules you have in your car and see what fault codes you have in other modules as well...................

1.9 Cdti ECU are not very common so before you fault your ECU make sure all other things are OK............

When you say its not starting......... you mean engine is not cranking at all or, its cranking but, will not fire up..........(please confirm this)

[dreamvictim]

When you say its not starting......... you mean engine is not cranking at all or, its cranking but, will not fire up..........(please confirm this)

Hi, It's not cranking at all.

The few times it did start it cut out again after a minute or so.

I will check the other modules for errors again, but intial tests showed up nothing. It does seem it has lost connection with the ecu, like a broken earth or something?

[dreamvictim]

Another thing to add is the car was subjected to some nasty wind and heavy rain during the night. My first thoughts were something had got wet but I can't find any water ingress.

[dreamvictim]

I just checked the other modules with opcom and there are other error codes but they relate to ECM not present or incorrect reading from ECM etc etc.

[TonyLow]

Hi i had the same problem. It cut out on me then wouldn't start, Tried with op-com couldn't find ECU so cleared the error codes with a powergate2 and the car started. This happened to me about 3 times and never really got around to the main problem. Got told that the main fuse box in the engine bay can cause this type of problem as it is prone to letting water into the plug connections for the main wiring harness, So i would leave the battery disconnected for 30 mins and then try to start the car.

[Ashraf6119]

Hi, It's not cranking at all.

The few times it did start it cut out again after a minute or so.

I will check the other modules for errors again, but intial tests showed up nothing. It does seem it has lost connection with the ecu, like a broken earth or something?


Hi

Can you read in ABS and CIM Module if there are any CAN-BUS related faults codes..........

Also try cleaning the ABS multi plug and see if that helps........

If you have any CAN-BUS faults in any module try cleaning its connections and see that helps...........

[bsv2001]

Hi
I think you have problem with + or ground in ECU
You must to install Opel Tis with wiring diagram And check ECU connection: +30, +15, ground, 2,56 V Can and k -line
If all Ok -you must change ECU
Op-com provide this without problem
Regards

[dreamvictim]

Can you read in ABS and CIM Module if there are any CAN-BUS related faults codes..........


I checked the other modules and the only codes that came up were relating to no connection to ECM.

I Just noticed something, whilst sitting in the car early this morning with the ignition switched on, it was very quiet so I was able to hear a faint clicking sound (not the usual clicks under the hood) these clicks went on longer.

Also is there a relay for the ecu?

[Ashraf6119]

Hi

Check the fuse box in Engine Box is it not water in there also the relay # 13 is for ECU # 14 is for Fuel Pump # 15 is for Ignition Main Circuit.............Also check fuse # 21, 22, 26, and 30 they all for engine management system...........check earth wires as well if I remember well this model ECU is fitted under the front N/S wing just under the head light check the multi plugs on ECU for poor/dirty connections............

[dreamvictim]

Hi

Check the fuse box in Engine Box is it not water in there also the relay # 13 is for ECU # 14 is for Fuel Pump # 15 is for Ignition Main Circuit.............Also check fuse # 21, 22, 26, and 30 they all for engine management system...........check earth wires as well if I remember well this model ECU is fitted under the front N/S wing just under the head light check the multi plugs on ECU for poor/dirty connections............

Thanks Ash for taking the time to post that diagram, it's exactly what I was looking for. Unfortunately it's raining outside now so I won't have enough time to check the relays tonight.

I had already checked the fusebox for water and checked all the fuses are ok. You are right about the ECU location, I checked the multi plugs and these are dry and look clean.

Thanks to everyone for your input on this, I spent hours yesterday and today looking for something obvious but i'm no expert. I think i'll just have to book it into Vauxhall for diagnosis. :(

[dreamvictim]

Update: Took ecu off, cover looked tampered with so I took it to a local place that (so say) do ecu repairs. Guy opened it up and said this has been repaired before but still wanted to charge me ?45 + vat to resolder all the joints. (only 2 joints right in the middle of the pcb were blue and crusty all the rest were nice and shiny).

I asked him if they had the means to test the ecu properly and he said no. No way was I paying him to do that without testing equipment, so I walked away.

I came home and cleaned the blue solder joints with a glass fibre pen, the joints didn't look cracked so I resealed the ecu and left it off the car overnight.

Plugged the ecu back into the car this morning and she fired straight away. Left engine running for 15 mins and then tried on/off a few times to make sure it would still start, all seemed good. (Another thing I noticed is the coil light came back, didn't notice this before but it didn't illuminate when she wouldn't start)

Anyway, left the car for 10-15mins and tried again. Engine started but TC light came on and revs went up, accelerator pedal wouldn't respond. Tried ignition on/off several times but still the same results. Another try and all the dashboard lights started to flash on/off and starter motor clicked, after several goes it went back to before with no connection to ecu and no start.

[dreamvictim]

Back to not starting again.. ECU relay clicks intermittently like crazy when I leave ignition on.

I think it's the ecu.

[obd.tech]

bypass relay....see if starts?

u need to check all modules....then with wiring diagram and test meter eliminate all possibilities before condeming the ecu.
A Pro would use a scientific approach.....not guess.

hope this helps
obd

[dreamvictim]

bypass relay....see if starts?

u need to check all modules....then with wiring diagram and test meter eliminate all possibilities before condeming the ecu.
A Pro would use a scientific approach.....not guess.

hope this helps
obd

We tried by passing the ecu relay but still didn't work. All other modules are ok in opcom.

[Ashraf6119]

Hi

If you think the ECU is at fault then here are few good deals on ebay.............Have a look...................

2006 56 VAUXHALL ZAFIRA 1.9 CDTI 120BHP ECU KIT BREAKING | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2006-56-VAUXHALL-ZAFIRA-1-9-CDTI-120BHP-ECU-KIT-BREAKING-/270990525730?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&fits=Model%3AZafira|Cars+Type%3A1.9+CDTI&hash=item3f184b4522)


Like this one ? 150 + ?15 for postage all included really you can't go wrong...........

[dreamvictim]

Hi Ash,

Thanks, that is a good deal but it says it's for the 120 bhp version and mine is the 150 bhp version :(

I sent the ECM to The ECU Doctor this morning for testing. They charge ?30 to test, if the ECU is faulty they charge ?120 + parts to repair.

[dreamvictim]

ECU came back from testing with no problems detected.

I plugged it back in yesterday and everything worked again, took it for a drive and did about 30 miles with no problems.

Started engine this morning, revs went up on their own and TC light came on, started a few times and revs kept going up. After a while it wouldn't start again. Now it cranks over and starts but cuts out straight away. So the original problem with not connecting to ECM has disappeared.

I plugged in OPCOM, cleared all old codes and did a diagnostic report with existing codes, i've attached it to this post if someone could take a look please.

[synkrotronic]

Sorry.
Confirm with the ecu connector disconnected,if relay work fine and if you get 12 V on pin A1.
To relay work use a probe lamp connected to negative and pin A72.

(ECM low battery error )

Regards

[dreamvictim]

Decided to book it in with Vauxhall, they told me it is either the ECU or ECU wiring. They are now checking all the wiring to the ecu.

[dreamvictim]

Vauxhall tell me that there is no problem with the wiring and that there is 12v going to the ecu but it is only outputting 3v.

[Ashraf6119]

Vauxhall tell me that there is no problem with the wiring and that there is 12v going to the ecu but it is only outputting 3v.


It could be poor earth connections some where which is causing this and your output is 3 volt..................You need to check the wirings again and carefully...................If they are 100% sure your ECU is OK..................

[dreamvictim]

It could be poor earth connections some where which is causing this and your output is 3 volt..................You need to check the wirings again and carefully...................If they are 100% sure your ECU is OK..................

I rang The ECU doctor today and he said exactly the same thing. He says the ECU was tested extensively and there were definately no faults found so it has to be a wiring fault.

This is driving me crazy.

How can I put in a temporary earth to check?

[super jumbe]

You could laugh at me but try starting the car with easy start first and let us know what happened.

[smirnoff_rules]

l wouldnt use easy start unless u really know wot your doing .. these engines can rev there tits off and go bang easy

[super jumbe]

When ever an AA man comes to start the car the first thing they try is the easy start, I think some engines may have gone bang? http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/images/smilies/roflmao.gif http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/images/smilies/roflmao.gif

[Ashraf6119]

When ever an AA man comes to start the car the first thing they try is the easy start, I think some engines may have gone bang? :roflmao: :roflmao:


In that case I would say they don't know they job............

And in dreamvictim case his having an intermittent Engine ECU Communication problem..........So, if there is NO communication with Engine ECU you can end up using even 10 cans of easy start and it will still NOT start.............:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:

[super jumbe]

I have never got car started with any advice given hear, the last Zafira I got it sorted with the knowledge of a friend.

Any chemicals production factory will be closed by govt if its products is danger to the peoples or to the engine..

The reason I said to spray easy start is that you will have checked the car if the fuel is not coming or the catalyst is blocked because OBD tools can not read fuel pump and blocked catalyst the tool only read fuel relays.

If the car starts with easy start you have a fuel problem and if your car doesn?t start your catalyst is blocked or your timing belt has moved few teethes.

Now tell me which tool you will check if your catalyst is block?

[Ashraf6119]

Have you read his first post to know what is his problem.........?

His having a intermittent problem with Engine ECU Communication and not fuel or blocked Cat....................

[super jumbe]

How could you be really 100% certain, his OBD tool can be faulty not connecting, or may have some com port issues.

He said his ECU was checked to be ok, car started then engine stopped after 30 minutes.

I had a car in the garage once and having the same problem I could not believe it the car will start run for 15, 20 minutes then stops and when a friend told me to check the timing belt I laugh at him, found out it was the timing belt, another way to check if it?s a wiring fault you must check the following things, see if the fuel is coming in the injectors and not at the pipe, if the fuel is coming out it could not be the wiring problem.

The owner is telling us that it?s a ecu issue which I think a faulty ecu or wiring will automatically trigger the immo light on the dash!!!!!

[Ashraf6119]

:hmmmm2::hmmmm2::hmmmm2:

[dreamvictim]

How could you be really 100% certain, his OBD tool can be faulty not connecting, or may have some com port issues.

It's not just my OBD tool, Vauxhall have tech2'd it and diagnosed it as a faulty ECU. I originally thought it was an ECU fault until a bench test came back as ok, because of that result vauxhall carried out extensive wiring tests and are now certain it is not a wiring fault, but an ECU fault. Perhaps the ECU's journey in the post made it work long enough to pass the test, who knows.

The ECU did work for 30 miles and then the fault changed after it came back from testing and the car wasn't moved prior to that so that says something.

[smirnoff_rules]

l have never trusted ecu testers m8 ,, there lairs m8 . normally its the other ways around they say its ~~~~ed and its not

[super jumbe]

Glade you got it sorted mate as we were getting confused!!!