Advice buying electronic key cutting machine.

[Manta1600]

I never used Silca or Keyline but on youtube they looks very slowly and heavy

they need clamps for very simple keys and I can't see option to make own program for new keys

I hate machines that need to change the clamps even just rotate the clamp or machines that need 1 minute measuring before start the cut

lets to compare the speed on some common keys like HU100 HON66 and TOY48 from press the start button to cut the first side and take the blade in hand

[Spiritech]

I never used Silca or Keyline but on youtube they looks very slowly and heavy

they need clamps for very simple keys and I can't see option to make own program for new keys

I hate machines that need to change the clamps even just rotate the clamp or machines that need 1 minute measuring before start the cut

lets to compare the speed on some common keys like HU100 HON66 and TOY48 from press the start button to cut the first side and take the blade in hand

Futura Auto is your machine then, they have a self-centering near universal clamp for all track keys, only need to change for edge cut, tibbe or tubular keys. The gauging process is quicker than say a Dolphin. Keyline Gymkana is similar as well. But neither of these machines do a particularly good job of edge cuts.

I mean the ideal thing is a Unocode 299/399, a Triax, a Delta/Orion, a Crown but fitting all that in a van means no room for stock or actually working, plus the weight. Working mobile is always a compromise between speed, weight, space and flexibility.

[rapidlocksmiths]

on my service van i have a silca viper , ninja laser and A6 as well as a silca delta , silca delta fo and a silca matrix , my most used machine by a clear mile is my silca viper that ive used on the van and in workshop for 20 years , great machine thats cut around 300k keys and still works perfectly every day. how many modern machines will give that level of service for that length of time and still be spot on. in my workshop i have a selection of machines as well .

The ninja laser has to date been a good machine , always cut a perfect key and always quickly , the only pain is the boot up time for the liger software consul which is 3 to 4 minutes , 7 years of untroubled service so far.

the A6 although may be moved to the workshop as rarely used , has been a reliable little unit but not in the same league .

The viper , 300k keys over 20 years , still looks as good and still works as hard as when new and still cuts spot on , i suspect will outlive the rest by a considerable time .

i dont look at a machine for its cutting speed , though ninja and viper cut quickly and perfectly every time , 1st time , what i look at is my investment , yes they were far dearer machines and heavier than the new machines , but they will outlive and out perform the new breed of machines , cutting more keys and offering long term reliability , i cant see me needing another machine before i retire and i can imagine them giving someone many more years service when i retire , i bought machines for the long term even life of my career . viper doesnt have the coverage of the ninja laser or the futura but will outlive both for a long time as built to last.

when smaller lighter machines were released they started with the miracle A5 , then the a6 and the china offerings , all bidding to be the cheapest , the lightest with the widest coverage , but to achieve this the build quality could not be the same , so no longer built for life , silca and keyline have brought their own cheaper machines out to compete , but none will give the length of service of the heavier duty machines like viper , unocode , triax etc .

if i was setting up again with 40 years ahead of me i would have triax and unocode if funds allowed as unlikely to have to buy again.

each to own on machine choice , but for me its about the payback from my investment and my machine choices have given me that .

[Manta1600]

Rapid 300k keys for 20 years are 40 keys per day are you sleeping?

[rapidlocksmiths]

no , i used to cut alot of key blades to code for alot of dealerships still do alot now , also before lishi i used to cut thousands of overlifter keys for various tool suppliers for their overlifter sets , and my many years on lishi development i used to cut test blades for the test locks for the picking and decoding , we tested all prototype tools for uk market on 6 bench locks and at least 2 live cars before production , then a random 4 tools used to be selected from every production batch to test on the same 6 locks and 2 live cars , on popular tools when new there was 8 to 10 batch runs a year.
then theres the trade shows and the training classes where we cut blades for demo and training decodes and trainees own vehicles

the blades ive cut the most of where HU100 and hu46 as used to have a contract pinning locks and cutting blades for vauxhall , i also made a lot of blades for local breakers stripping and selling the lock sets from the yard .

but by far the most was overlifter keys for overlifter sets that were heavily sold before lishi , 60 keys per set and i used to get orders for 100 sets at a time , vag jiggler sets , bmw jiggler sets , try out keys for alot of edge key models and a shed load of depth and space keys , rake keys , you would be shocked how many sets of these used to be sold across europe before lishi and cheap cut to code machines came along , most auto lockies had overlifters , depth and space keys , try out keys , rake keys and jigglers in their tool boxes. before lishi blind touch tools and before decoders and before cheap cut to code machines were available we had to work for our money and we all used depth and space keys , overlifters and rake keys etc , huge market for these as all we had , its been made very easy now , the upside was though that not so many wanted to get into auto in those days as had to learn to work.

at the time i was doing this my only machines for this were viper and blitz and alot of hand finishing . blitz also made alot of bump key sets for suppliers too over many years.

ive cut a lot of keys over the last 20 years

[Manta1600]

Futura Auto is your machine then, they have a self-centering near universal clamp for all track keys, only need to change for edge cut, tibbe or tubular keys. The gauging process is quicker than say a Dolphin. Keyline Gymkana is similar as well. But neither of these machines do a particularly good job of edge cuts.

I mean the ideal thing is a Unocode 299/399, a Triax, a Delta/Orion, a Crown but fitting all that in a van means no room for stock or actually working, plus the weight. Working mobile is always a compromise between speed, weight, space and flexibility.

Futura for sure is not my machine - there is clamp that must be replaced also a some metal algment parts that must be used

I use SEC E9 that is Miracle based machine that need separate addapter only for FO21

I can't understand why they going back and their new machines Alpha and Betta have rotated clamps like Xhorse

Also their new machines need more time to measure the clamp before start to cut the key

[Spiritech]

Futura for sure is not my machine - there is clamp that must be replaced also a some metal algment parts that must be used

I use SEC E9 that is Miracle based machine that need separate addapter only for FO21

I can't understand why they going back and their new machines Alpha and Betta have rotated clamps like Xhorse

Also their new machines need more time to measure the clamp before start to cut the key

Futura Auto uses an entirely different jaw arrangement to Futura and Futura Pro. It's a self centering near universal jaw for track keys. Yes you need to replace for edge cuts but it's not great at edge cuts in the first place.

[rapidlocksmiths]

Futura for sure is not my machine - there is clamp that must be replaced also a some metal algment parts that must be used

I use SEC E9 that is Miracle based machine that need separate addapter only for FO21

I can't understand why they going back and their new machines Alpha and Betta have rotated clamps like Xhorse

Also their new machines need more time to measure the clamp before start to cut the key

I have a clamp for fo21 on ninja laser as came with the machine , ive never used it and doubt i ever will i also have a tibbe clamp for the old condor machine , also never used, i have had a silca delta fo for tibbe on my van for past 20 years , never missed a beat and id hate to guess at how many keys its cut , but quickly cuts 6 and 8 cut tibbe perfectly every time , not used as much now as it was when every ford and jaguar had a tibbe key , but i still do 6 to 8 tibbe most weeks on transit and older cars , still alot of transit mk7 and old fiesta about , very quick and always a perfect key , great little work horse that will outlive me.

cant beat a good dedicated machine for these.